Create a Classic Competition 2019

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DJ Full
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Re: Create a Classic Competition 2019

Post by DJ Full » 04 Jul 2019 18:19

Titak wrote:
04 Jul 2019 16:46
TombExplorer wrote:
04 Jul 2019 00:41
AgentXP wrote:
04 Jul 2019 00:25
anyone who is not a member of TRF and is either unwilling or unable to join on there due to a ban will not be added to the TRF list of builders or included in the TRF competition voting, as I am NOT prepared to break TRF rules.
I knew that the true reason behind that decision were banned people-related. But I didn't get any ban at all in there lol. That is why I'm asking to be included.
Is Agent speaking Chinese or something? :thinking: I think she has been very clear about it. She said you can build your level and submit it to trle.net, no problem.
Sorry Titak, but I think it's between the lines... I also didn't notice it until TombExplorer has mentioned it (my bad, I'm usually too positive to see evil intentions). But it seems we're dealing with power abuse and it should be clarified... There is no rule forbidding to mention banned people, you can talk about banned people, so adding them to the list is OK since it's an information about those people, not passing their voice (which is prohibited indeed). But what happened was Agent was explicitly told to not even mention them, and that's just abusing her - a friendly competition she created is used to channel too much admin power, to me she's been censored and blackmailed and I'm not gonna let it pass without calling it out because it's a disgrace NO MATTER if it affected her decision or not. Shame. That's all I have to say.

Regardless from this thing, the forum voting was in tradition of previous competitions, Agent has decided it to be like this BEFORE this entire thing happened, so I'm sure this is the global major reason of setting it identically again. There could surely be alternate ways like strawpoll or trle.net reviewing but those are overall more trouble for more people, unless I'm misinformed...
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Re: Create a Classic Competition 2019

Post by PedroTheGamer » 04 Jul 2019 20:03

I agree with you :|
Last edited by PedroTheGamer on 04 Jul 2019 20:05, edited 1 time in total.
I'm actually happy to be here, but so many projects, that I hardly know which one to start / finish, any idea? :roll:

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Re: Create a Classic Competition 2019

Post by Jorge22 » 04 Jul 2019 20:04

I'm starting to lose my interest in this competition...

Btw, last year's BtB was the best that I can remember. Sadly, not everybody thought so.
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Re: Create a Classic Competition 2019

Post by DJ Full » 04 Jul 2019 20:42

Jorge22 wrote:
04 Jul 2019 20:04
I'm starting to lose my interest in this competition...
I'm sorry you felt like this Jorge, but I had to say it.
Usually in such cases I stay silent and then regret.
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Re: Create a Classic Competition 2019

Post by PedroTheGamer » 04 Jul 2019 20:58

Jorge22 wrote:
04 Jul 2019 20:04
I'm starting to lose my interest in this competition...

Btw, last year's BtB was the best that I can remember. Sadly, not everybody thought so.
don't worry Jorge, you will have fun, do not be unmotivated we are trying to solve a problem of "abuse of power" and that AgentXP has been censored, do not put banned members on the competition list, For second dj_full there are no rules that says ( that banned members of BTB, CAC competitions, bids are not allowed).
so let's dig deeper to find out who you are. :|
I'm actually happy to be here, but so many projects, that I hardly know which one to start / finish, any idea? :roll:

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Re: Create a Classic Competition 2019

Post by TombExplorer » 04 Jul 2019 21:17

Titak wrote:
04 Jul 2019 16:46
TombExplorer wrote:
04 Jul 2019 00:41
AgentXP wrote:
04 Jul 2019 00:25
You are of course free to build a classic level and release around the same time if you wish. :) But anyone who is not a member of TRF and is either unwilling or unable to join on there due to a ban will not be added to the TRF list of builders or included in the TRF competition voting, as I am NOT prepared to break TRF rules. Please don’t keep asking me to do this guys. :(
I knew that the true reason behind that decision were banned people-releated. But I didn't get any ban at all in there lol. That is why I'm asking to be included. I don't think that should be a problem? You won't break the rules(at least you won't by adding me, I'm not sure about the others) :blank:
Is Agent speaking Chinese or something? :thinking:
I think she has been very clear about it.

She said you can build your level and submit it to trle.net, no problem.

Same goes for PedroTheGamer obviously. Officially part of the competition or not, you will still be able to prove you are not stealing other people's work anymore. :2thumbsup:
Why should I be considered different from everyone else? I want to be in the competition officially as it should be.
On a side note, I'm not even banned, so there is no excuse. I'm just asking in the most polite way to be treated fairly.

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Re: Create a Classic Competition 2019

Post by Titak » 05 Jul 2019 00:01

DJ Full wrote:
04 Jul 2019 18:19
Titak wrote:
04 Jul 2019 16:46
TombExplorer wrote:
04 Jul 2019 00:41
I knew that the true reason behind that decision were banned people-related. But I didn't get any ban at all in there lol. That is why I'm asking to be included.
Is Agent speaking Chinese or something? :thinking: I think she has been very clear about it. She said you can build your level and submit it to trle.net, no problem.
Sorry Titak, but I think it's between the lines... I also didn't notice it until TombExplorer has mentioned it (my bad, I'm usually too positive to see evil intentions). But it seems we're dealing with power abuse and it should be clarified... There is no rule forbidding to mention banned people, you can talk about banned people, so adding them to the list is OK since it's an information about those people, not passing their voice (which is prohibited indeed). But what happened was Agent was explicitly told to not even mention them, and that's just abusing her - a friendly competition she created is used to channel too much admin power, to me she's been censored and blackmailed and I'm not gonna let it pass without calling it out because it's a disgrace NO MATTER if it affected her decision or not. Shame. That's all I have to say.

Regardless from this thing, the forum voting was in tradition of previous competitions, Agent has decided it to be like this BEFORE this entire thing happened, so I'm sure this is the global major reason of setting it identically again. There could surely be alternate ways like strawpoll or trle.net reviewing but those are overall more trouble for more people, unless I'm misinformed...
Number 4 here: https://www.tombraiderforums.com/showth ... p?t=181343
Adding to the list would qualify as relaying a message from a banned member, since the message "I want to participate in the competition" comes from the banned member himself.

I have to admit I do not like your "abuse of power" and "blackmailing" comments.
Those are strong accusations and they are not valid imo.

You are right about talking about a banned member. There's no rule for that.
But when there is talking about a banned member, it will ofcourse be common courtesy to not talk about stuff where the member would normally need to tell his side of the story, since he won't be able to do that while being banned.


The reviews on trle.net or even something like strawpoll could indeed be used instead of a voting thing on TRF.
But that's up to AgentXP to decide whether or not she'd want to do something like that.
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only in contradiction with what we know of it.


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Re: Create a Classic Competition 2019

Post by Jorge22 » 05 Jul 2019 00:06

DJ Full wrote:
04 Jul 2019 20:42
Jorge22 wrote:
04 Jul 2019 20:04
I'm starting to lose my interest in this competition...
I'm sorry you felt like this Jorge, but I had to say it.
Usually in such cases I stay silent and then regret.
Well, but I do understand. It's just that I'm not in the mood for wars and us humans, we seem to have a natural knack for just that. And it's only a comment. I want things to be peaceful, that's all. Whatever's going down wherever it's going down isn't my business, anyway - I understand that too. It's just that... let's stay together, right? :)
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Re: Create a Classic Competition 2019

Post by PedroTheGamer » 05 Jul 2019 01:03

Number 4 here: https://www.tombraiderforums.com/showth ... p?t=181343
Adding to the list would qualify as relaying a message from a banned member, since the message "I want to participate in the competition" comes from the banned member himself.

I have to admit I do not like your "abuse of power" and "blackmailing" comments.
Those are strong accusations and they are not valid imo.

You are right about talking about a banned member. There's no rule for that.
But when there is talking about a banned member, it will ofcourse be common courtesy to not talk about stuff where the member would normally need to tell his side of the story, since he won't be able to do that while being banned.


The reviews on trle.net or even something like strawpoll could indeed be used instead of a voting thing on TRF.
But that's up to AgentXP to decide whether or not she'd want to do something like that
.

I read this rule, what is "abuse of power" and (I simply banned user, ask AgentXP to add me the list of competition builders) the rule is, relay menssagers of banned users, ie, it is forbidden to send messages in the banned users forum, the rule does not say that "a banned user can not ask the owner of the competition topic to put you on the list (you are doing this) which is not a rule.
I'm actually happy to be here, but so many projects, that I hardly know which one to start / finish, any idea? :roll:

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Re: Create a Classic Competition 2019

Post by Titak » 05 Jul 2019 01:17

Yes it is. Because you ask to be on the list: it is a message from you.
And by putting you on the list it would be relaying a message from a banned member.
Nothing is in contradiction with nature,
only in contradiction with what we know of it.


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Re: Create a Classic Competition 2019

Post by PedroTheGamer » 05 Jul 2019 02:32

Titak wrote:
05 Jul 2019 01:17
Yes it is. Because you ask to be on the list: it is a message from you.
And by putting you on the list it would be relaying a message from a banned member.
you're wrong! the rule says "send messages banned members in TRF" I was not asking him to send messages for me in the forum, just ask that the list of builders is added to me, which is not a rule :-P
I'm actually happy to be here, but so many projects, that I hardly know which one to start / finish, any idea? :roll:

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Re: Create a Classic Competition 2019

Post by DJ Full » 05 Jul 2019 02:50

Yes Jorge, I'm all about it. I'm about staying together.
I was really glad about this competition because I considered it better than BtB.
Because I thought we finally have something everyone can join without any restrictions.
I don't know why there needs to always be a problem with that.

And yes Titia, that's precisely why I read this list in a forum-independent context.
If you don't, it just creates an unfair situation, banning art instead of users.
Same applies to people from outside of the forum, I think they should be put on it.
This should be totally permission-independent, or membership-independent.

I'm really sorry but the current thing just feels bad and I can't help it.
Probably it's the worst scenario when everybody is partially correct.
There's no perfect solution and I hate to have no solution.
I'm not against anybody. Only about made up barriers.
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Re: Create a Classic Competition 2019

Post by TombExplorer » 05 Jul 2019 12:18

DJ Full wrote:
05 Jul 2019 02:50
And yes Titia, that's precisely why I read this list in a forum-independent context.
If you don't, it just creates an unfair situation, banning art instead of users.
Same applies to people from outside of the forum, I think they should be put on it.
This should be totally permission-independent, or membership-independent.


I'm really sorry but the current thing just feels bad and I can't help it.
Probably it's the worst scenario when everybody is partially correct.
There's no perfect solution and I hate to have no solution.
I'm not against anybody. Only about made up barriers.
That is exactly what I think :?

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Re: Create a Classic Competition 2019

Post by MichaelP » 05 Jul 2019 16:53

I did not read every word of this encounter, but the whole debate is extremely childish...

"Abuse of Power" of all things? - I have indeed personally been accused of that several times in the last 18 years of running trle.net - and let me tell you that each and every time that accusation was completely justified! Why? Because, believe it or not, I am the admin of this site. I run it. And I run it the way I want it to be run. Yes, Yes, Yes, obviously I have the aspiration to do things in the best interest of the trle community - but at the end of the day the only judge of what that "best interest" may be is me, myself and I. Abuse of power? Sure, absolutely!

Now - translating that reality to the CaC competition: AgentXP is running it and defining the rules of how it is being run. End of story. If those rules require you to have an account on TRF, then so be it. If you - for whatever reason - do not want to have an account on TRF, well then it is very simple: You choose not to participate. Nobody else to blame but your own choice. If you would like to have an account but cannot get one because of earlier actions of yourself at TRF then tough luck - you can not participate. Again, nobody else to blame but yourself.
Absolutely nothing to argue about here. The people who run the show are the people who make the rules and in order for things to work out you play by the rules or you don't play. Simple.

And by the way, those who have participated in BtB before know that it is EXACTLY the same there:
- You can ONLY participate in BtB if you have an account here.
- And you can ONLY participate in BtB if you trust me with your personal name and postal mailing address.
If you don't trust me on that, that is perfectly fine and your right of course, but then you choose to NOT participate.

So there - I will "abuse my power" as an admin of the site or as an owner of running any kind of competition anytime and I think AgentXP should do exactly the same and not take any heat for that from anyone. Because if people just keep bullying the (actually relatively few people) who really actively DO something for the community to prosper, then these few people will stop doing that and the community will quietly just die... So - think before you argue… ;)
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Re: Create a Classic Competition 2019

Post by PedroTheGamer » 05 Jul 2019 17:05

AgentXP said that I can do / send without problems on the day, I will not be on the list + I will not be able to vote the 3 favorites. But that does not matter. I have permission to Build too. The abuse of power is not you MichaelP. :-P
I'm actually happy to be here, but so many projects, that I hardly know which one to start / finish, any idea? :roll:

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