Reviews and level concept

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MichaelP
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Re: Reviews and level concept

Post by MichaelP » 09 Jun 2020 10:30

What you fail to see and acknowledge here is that you are all kind of "right" in general... while some are thinking others are "wrong"...

I do have to disagree with the starting statement though: "My job as a reviewer is to push the builder to their maximum potential."??

Err - no, absolutely NOT!

Builders will choose what to do with the feedback they are getting. It is not for the Reviewer to decide what the review does to a builder, because it is not your decision to make or influence. If you - with good intentions - point out flaws that can be corrected or improved, that may inspire some builders to do better next time, but it may cause others to be completely frustrated with the lack of appreciation they get for their hard work and they never touch the editor again. You of all people should be aware of that - because you were exactly in that place already...

And indeed you can never really criticize the perception (!) of another player and the scoring of another player, because it reflects the playing experience of that player and well, you were not there, so you cannot judge how it was for that person...

Granted, there are at times outliers which are questionable, when 90% of the people think one thing and 10% are completely on the other end, but that is exactly what these are: Outliers. And these remind us that not all people think alike - and Thankfully so, because if that were the case we really only needed ONE review per level each time and all the rest would be redundant copies... :p

Bottomline, both Deandre and Jorge have their style of reviewing and as long as they review consistently and true to their own (!) style then that is perfectly fine.
There is no need to patronize the respective other about having to change, because neither of you is doing better or worse than the other ... ;)
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Re: Reviews and level concept

Post by Jorge22 » 09 Jun 2020 11:13

After having given it a little thought, at the risk of making it sound as if I think you intervened to defend me against somebody else, as well as that I can't help having the famous last words, all things taken into account, thank you for bringing some sense into this. :)
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Re: Reviews and level concept

Post by StudBuddha » 09 Jun 2020 15:35

MichaelP wrote:
09 Jun 2020 10:30
What you fail to see and acknowledge here is that you are all kind of "right" in general... while some are thinking others are "wrong"...

I do have to disagree with the starting statement though: "My job as a reviewer is to push the builder to their maximum potential."??

Err - no, absolutely NOT!

Builders will choose what to do with the feedback they are getting. It is not for the Reviewer to decide what the review does to a builder, because it is not your decision to make or influence. If you - with good intentions - point out flaws that can be corrected or improved, that may inspire some builders to do better next time, but it may cause others to be completely frustrated with the lack of appreciation they get for their hard work and they never touch the editor again. You of all people should be aware of that - because you were exactly in that place already...

And indeed you can never really criticize the perception (!) of another player and the scoring of another player, because it reflects the playing experience of that player and well, you were not there, so you cannot judge how it was for that person...

Granted, there are at times outliers which are questionable, when 90% of the people think one thing and 10% are completely on the other end, but that is exactly what these are: Outliers. And these remind us that not all people think alike - and Thankfully so, because if that were the case we really only needed ONE review per level each time and all the rest would be redundant copies... :p

Bottomline, both Deandre and Jorge have their style of reviewing and as long as they review consistently and true to their own (!) style then that is perfectly fine.
There is no need to patronize the respective other about having to change, because neither of you is doing better or worse than the other ... ;)
You are absolutely correct and I completely agree with you. And that's why my levels are totally open for any adventurer 0-10 rating it's their choice. Tell me what I did wrong. What could I have done better? What didn't you like? or did like. I have no problem with that. I see it as a through the fire situation, but that's just me.

I try my best to not trash on levels. That's why I thought the long thorough reviews would help most. So they can take some time off and bring a better project to the world.

Not to say other builders are like me. What if someone respected me as a reviewer? And looked at my profile to see what was my perspective of a good raid is. I haven't even been able to play through some of the best TRLEs made here on this site yet.

Even some levels I like to betatest. I respect their decisions in the direction they want to go. All I'm really doing is somewhat betatesting/and just playing/raiding these levels when I download them. Melnikov Island by StormChaser for example I recently beta tested. I didn't steer him in my direction of how I would have created that level. That's not fair to him. It's his choice in what he wanted to create. That's the fun part of playing other creator's levels. When I played the level, all I did was point out technical errors like enemies running into walls, or spamming pushables in the same situations, suggest fixing boxy rooms. (When I point it out, it is usually consistent). Then he sent it to me again for the final. Some advice he took, some he didn't. It was fine. Still a fun raid. I just tried to make sure everything worked for the public. I always try my best to point out the positives in the games because I wouldn't have played through it, finished it, or even rated it if I didn't find enjoyment in the level. If that's too much. My recent review of Osvaldo is pretty much a tale, I will just leave his levels alone.

Sabatu's recent level for example. I felt really bad but I had to give him a 7 which I thought was fair. If he updates the level, I would love to replay it. I even try to remember to tell them that.

I'm finding a lot of builders with talent. If they don't want to show it to the world. Then that's fine. But if I would like to play it, I am going to try to rate it fairly as best I can. And still find enjoyment in what anyone has presented to me as the player.

And I see what I've done over the past few days. I finally was able to do a short raid through of some levels I found that could be fun. And I rated them just how I enjoyed them. I was pretty tired from building, playing some Tekken, and I wanted to rest.

I don't have to call it out again. I can even understand how that would be judging someone else's perception.
Then you might like to mind...the bell.

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Re: Reviews and level concept

Post by Storm Chaser » 11 Jun 2020 00:35

As my latest level Melnikov Island has been mentioned in these posts I thought I’d add my thoughts. Reviews are IMHO always interesting and valid be they negative or positive. If they are negative I tend to think that next time I’ll bare that in mind and if positive then I can feel all smug! So in Melnikov Island there is a room comprising of loads of boxes in a maze like area that are stacked up to 5 high with a key to collect, plus a secret and several pickups and it’s quite high so if you fall off you can die. I rather liked it and so kept it in. However two reviews had totally opposing opinions of this room.

“....... the worst example being the large warehouse with nothing to do except finding one key and the respective keyhole......”

“..... I especially enjoyed the yard with the hundreds of crates in it.....“

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Re: Reviews and level concept

Post by StudBuddha » 11 Jun 2020 13:49

My levels are meant to be warnings to Tomb Raider fans. I can care less about the bad reviews. I don't really have any. 0-10 scale. :)

Point is, rebellion and proud sin is death. There is no such thing as running out of room in Hell. But luckily there is still time for a very few amount of us to still repent.

If I didn't somewhat care about your ever dying souls, I wouldn't have even bothered to try to warn you.

People think I'm upset by the lack of higher scores, the lack of interest to my style, or my review ratings. I thought the reviewing was pretty fun but I guess I'm doing too much. Creating the levels were definitely an experience. Anyone wonder why I'm quite elaborate on dogs?

Besides all of that, what's going on in this site is nothing short of criminal. And I'm not even talking about the differences in the way in which people review/rate levels. Because we can see that's all over the place.
Then you might like to mind...the bell.

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Re: Reviews and level concept

Post by Jorge22 » 12 Jun 2020 21:41

I'm absolutely puzzled and I absolutely mean it.
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Re: Reviews and level concept

Post by Nomad » 13 Jun 2020 00:09

The world does not need another troll, nor a prophet.

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Re: Reviews and level concept

Post by StudBuddha » 13 Jun 2020 05:36

Jorge22 wrote:
12 Jun 2020 21:41
I'm absolutely puzzled and I absolutely mean it.
I feel the same away you throwing out 9's but I guess we'll have to accept that now won't we?
Last edited by StudBuddha on 13 Jun 2020 05:41, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Reviews and level concept

Post by StudBuddha » 13 Jun 2020 05:38

Nomad wrote:
13 Jun 2020 00:09
The world does not need another troll, nor a prophet.
I'm neither. I'm just a messenger. I'm no different than the average man.
Then you might like to mind...the bell.

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Jorge22
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Re: Reviews and level concept

Post by Jorge22 » 13 Jun 2020 12:35

Something cultural from the upcoming album Rough and Rowdy Ways (19 June). :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2QPBpFAKTGo
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Re: Reviews and level concept

Post by StudBuddha » 13 Jun 2020 16:28

Jorge22 wrote:
13 Jun 2020 12:35
Something cultural from the upcoming album Rough and Rowdy Ways (19 June). :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2QPBpFAKTGo
Well that album art is not very nice and I read those lyrics.
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Jorge22
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Re: Reviews and level concept

Post by Jorge22 » 13 Jun 2020 18:06

Whatever you say. But thou shalt not diminish the Nobel laureate for he is a true son of God, blessed with divine inspiration by the Holy Spirit.

The last poet. One of the last living legends too. Who else is currently there that's not a singing monkey made famous by TV shows?

Sure, there are still a few. But in little activity.

And art doesn't have to be nice. It needs to be good. Do you mean to say that maybe the hanging ape in the background makes you uncomfortable?
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Re: Reviews and level concept

Post by StudBuddha » 13 Jun 2020 20:43

Jorge22 wrote:
13 Jun 2020 18:06
Whatever you say. But thou shalt not diminish the Nobel laureate for he is a true son of God, blessed with divine inspiration by the Holy Spirit.

The last poet. One of the last living legends too. Who else is currently there that's not a singing monkey made famous by TV shows?

Sure, there are still a few. But in little activity.
No...Just false idols.
Jorge22 wrote:
13 Jun 2020 18:06
And art doesn't have to be nice. It needs to be good. Do you mean to say that maybe the hanging ape in the background makes you uncomfortable?
Ape huh? No that was a man who has been lynched in the background. Just like the man was murdered by dogs in the opening of Tomb Raider I. I couldn't imagine four of them...And he died with the mark of the beast over him. Lara Croft couldn't save him obviously. Croft opened it up to him, was slow and even got irritated to rid the dogs. Again...idolatry.
Then you might like to mind...the bell.

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Re: Reviews and level concept

Post by Jorge22 » 13 Jun 2020 21:25

I really think we're watching different things, both in that image and on Tomb Raider... Never mind. Just please, do show respect for your Nobel prize winner, because he's more respectable than most and certainly more than self-conceited hypocrites (or antichrist characters, to use your kind of imagery) :)
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Re: Reviews and level concept

Post by eRIC » 14 Jun 2020 16:44

Jorge22 wrote:
13 Jun 2020 18:06
But thou shalt not diminish the Nobel laureate for he is a true son of God, blessed with divine inspiration by the Holy Spirit.
reading this is truly incredible ... Jorge you are seriously mistaken.
wrote: Just please, do show respect for your Nobel prize winner
thou shall not ... do show respect …. => seriously ??? :?

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