Raising blocks ....

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inchdix
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Raising blocks ....

Post by inchdix » 25 Oct 2009 12:50

I am trying to make a raising block that is 10 clicks high. I have added the extra vertices to raising block 2 (the 8-click one) using meta, retextured it in stripx and added it to my WAD. In-game, it is the correct height and in the lowered position the collision is correct, but when raised the collision is still only 8 clicks, not 10 ..... so lara will pull up onto the block but the actual visible top of the block is at her waist.
I can edit the block to increase its collision height and this is fine in the raised position but obviously in the lowered position the collision is 2 clicks above the floor !

Am I assuming correctly that the collision height is hardcoded in the EXE ? Can anyone suggest a way around this ?

I am pretty sure I can mess aound with other things to get the required effect but it would be nice to be able to achieve it with just this edited block ........

Thanks.

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Mulf
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Re: Raising blocks ....

Post by Mulf » 25 Oct 2009 14:00

Indeed, it's hardcoded...RB1 is 4 clicks, RB2 8 clicks high, the size and shape of the mesh doesn't matter.
A workaround might be employing the RB for visual effect only, while the height of the floor is actually modified by a single-square 10-clicks flipped room, or possibly by an invisible BRIDGE_FLAT. You'd have to ensure though that the different floor collisions don't interfere, so I suppose you'd have to have a vertical portal at height 10 and a flipmap anyway.
I'd suggest you use the mesh you made for a TWOBLOCK_PLATFORM instead of an RB. That way you wouldn't have to bother with interfering floor collisons, plus the mesh would be seen actually rising instead of just stretching. :) Although you'd probably need a flipmap anyway for collision on the sides.

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Re: Raising blocks ....

Post by inchdix » 25 Oct 2009 16:58

yep ..... pretty much thought it was hard-coded. I had considered using flip-maps or the bridgeflat item as a workaround but neither are really viable for for what I am trying to set up ....... the simplest solution, I can see, is to use both RB's to attain a height of 12 clicks instead of 10 which is no problem ..... I just needed more than 8 clicks.

Hopefully this will work ok ..... I'll just have to be spot on with any camera work.

Either way, thanks Mulf!

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Re: Raising blocks ....

Post by inchdix » 27 Oct 2009 12:36

Well it turns out that after a fair amount of experimenting, nearly every solution works ..... physically ...... but is horrible visually! The only thing that works properly visually as well as physically is to use the 8-click block as it was meant to be used. Fortunately I could adjust the various rooms to do this ...... It's just that I know that in another circumstance, any of the other solutions would have worked just fine ...... but then that's winroomedit for you :beadyeyes:

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Mulf
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Re: Raising blocks ....

Post by Mulf » 27 Oct 2009 16:52

I recommended you go for the TWOBLOCK_PLATFORM option...adjustable to any height, and visually more appealing. :)

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Re: Raising blocks ....

Post by inchdix » 28 Oct 2009 08:05

I must admit I did not try the two-block option but I will bear it in mind for the future ....... as I have actually finished making the adjustments I needed for use with the 8-click block.

Btw, am I right in thinking the two-block rises a lot slower and that lara can stand on it while its rising with no "iffy" cameras ??

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Re: Raising blocks ....

Post by Mulf » 30 Oct 2009 07:13

inchdix wrote:Btw, am I right in thinking the two-block rises a lot slower and that lara can stand on it while its rising with no "iffy" cameras ??
Well, I'm not sure what you mean by "iffy" cameras, but if you're referring to cameras bobbing up and down, that may happen in confined areas such as one-square shafts, I believe...
As for the first question, the speed of the Twoblock, like the height to which it rises, is variable and depends on its OCB value, which is calculated by the formula h * 16 + v, with h being the height (in clicks) to which it is supposed to rise, and v its speed. The speed must be within the interval [0; 15], with 0 being the slowest, 15 the fastest speed.
Another advantage of the TWOBLOCK_PLATFORM over RAISING_BLOCKs is that it allows for continuous movement while Lara is standing on it, while the blocks have only two discrete states (either it's up, or else it's down). The engine fakes its movement in game by stretching the mesh upward. (That's why you can see Lara climbing in or standing on thin air in custom levels ever so often.)

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Re: Raising blocks ....

Post by inchdix » 30 Oct 2009 11:18

Hmmmm thats handy to know ..... I assume the * in the formula is "multiply" ...... as in 10 clicks at max speed would be OCB 175 or is it "add" so the OCB would be 41 in this instance??

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Mulf
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Re: Raising blocks ....

Post by Mulf » 30 Oct 2009 11:26

I'd rather have a proper multiplication sign myself. :D But yes, it is supposed to be one, so 10 clicks at max speed would indeed be 10 * 16 + 15 = 175. :)

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Re: Raising blocks ....

Post by inchdix » 30 Oct 2009 13:49

Thought so Mulf ...... as I said, very handy info this. Obviously lifts are no longer an issue :D

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Raymond
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Re: Raising blocks ....

Post by Raymond » 30 Oct 2009 14:50

@inchdix
15 is still quite slow. As trng-user you don´t need to mess around with the OCB and you can have any velocity by using the Action. Move Upward-Trigger.

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Mulf
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Re: Raising blocks ....

Post by Mulf » 30 Oct 2009 17:52

Well, call me a nerd, but I tend to consider the algorithm used in TRLE to be simple enough. :D Admittedly I'm unfamiliar with TRNG (and having based the levels I'm currently working on on TREP, I'm unlikely to switch in the foreseeable future), but unless Paolone has implemented a mind-reading subroutine, there has to be some algorithm for defining height and speed in there, too.

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Raymond
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Re: Raising blocks ....

Post by Raymond » 30 Oct 2009 18:46

You simply choose hight and speed in a drop down-list in the trigger menu. :)

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Mulf
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Re: Raising blocks ....

Post by Mulf » 31 Oct 2009 23:08

So you can't see the algorithm anymore. Alright, saves you a not-so-complex multiplication-plus-addition operation, but I'm unwavering in holding up my opinion that this particular improvement is a very minor one at best. :)

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Re: Raising blocks ....

Post by Raymond » 01 Nov 2009 00:13

Nope, this isn´t true. As already said, much greater speeds are allowed and also sinking platforms. This can be expanded up to fully working elevators with keypad and door controls. And if you are good with the trng, you can create also horizontally moving platforms. :)

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