Overly Complex Levels

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Talos
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Re: Overly Complex Levels

Post by Talos » 02 Jan 2020 23:05

Phil wrote:
02 Jan 2020 12:55
Thanks, Talos. It's always wise to try and approach these matters from a builder's perspective, even if one is not a builder.
:wink:
Treeble wrote:
02 Jan 2020 21:27

If people decide what to play solely based on the cumulative review scores, ignoring everything else, then I don't really know what to say. This discussion about ratings (and/or categories) comes up every now and then, and it can be a very healthy one to be had, but let's not forget we're all just enthusiasts here.
Agree. As I always say, reviews (about anything) are subjective. I read reviews that said bad things about movies or books that I loved. People have to reason with their own heads, not because "it's nice because it has high grades" "it's ugly because it has low grades"...


Sorry for my english, guys :cry:

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Re: Overly Complex Levels

Post by Jorge22 » 02 Jan 2020 23:46

Too true. Professional critics have their own agendas too. Or they are frustrated artists/musicians/writers/etc.
I know that's generalizing but we're sort of in our own nicer world here.
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Re: Overly Complex Levels

Post by lizard queen » 06 Jan 2020 10:23

Ryan wrote:
02 Jan 2020 21:38
No one is going to not play a level because of one review that is more on the negative side...
Absolutely true! In fact, I actually decided TO play a level (Reflections) because of Torry's shall we say blunt review of it. You know the saying... there's no such thing as bad publicity. :D

The thing is... we ALL have a say that counts but ONLY when we actually review a level. That's the beauty of it. If you don't like or agree with what someone said in a review... well then get out there and counter it by doing your own review! You have that power.
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Re: Overly Complex Levels

Post by Torry » 06 Jan 2020 23:31

...... and that is democracy in it's finest form lizard queen. Even though you list six things that you personally disliked about the level you still gave it the perfect score. You can overlook these fallacies when you freely admit to resulting to the walk through and utilizing save games from other players whilst alas, I find this type of thing poor level design. Each to their own and I respect your opinion. Do not agree with it but I certainly respect it.

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Re: Overly Complex Levels

Post by lizard queen » 07 Jan 2020 02:02

Torry wrote:
06 Jan 2020 23:31
...... and that is democracy in it's finest form lizard queen. Even though you list six things that you personally disliked about the level you still gave it the perfect score. You can overlook these fallacies when you freely admit to resulting to the walk through and utilizing save games from other players whilst alas, I find this type of thing poor level design. Each to their own and I respect your opinion. Do not agree with it but I certainly respect it.
Yes... very true, I did list 6 things I disliked but I also listed 5 things I liked. And I can't really fault the builder for the "impossible" move simply because I wasn't skilled enough or didn't "get" the trick. Truth is once I had a look at the "video" walkthrough (afterwards), I saw the technique, retried it and got it in 5-6 tries. I also have yet to find a level where I have not had to resort to the walkthrough (including the original/official TR games, lol) so I'm certainly not going to fault any builder for that. So all in all, 5 likes/5 dislikes kinda negate themselves and the overall take away was a really excellent game from a very talented builder.

Thank you, Torry... I respect your opinions too. 8)
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Re: Overly Complex Levels

Post by Jorge22 » 07 Jan 2020 11:13

Res-pect! :D
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Re: Overly Complex Levels

Post by vimmers » 07 Jan 2020 12:01

i don't understand why you people read reviews before you play a level
i never do that
also i would recommend Michael to not public a review before after 2 months
so the newly added level get a chance to be reviewed fairly
with no influence by others
so if you are a serious reviewer you play the level and review
the level before the 2 months are gone

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Re: Overly Complex Levels

Post by lizard queen » 07 Jan 2020 13:10

vimmers wrote:
07 Jan 2020 12:01
i don't understand why you people read reviews before you play a level
i never do that...
There was a time way back when I thought the same thing about the walkthroughs. They come out soooo fast that you can't even participate in the "Stuck in a Level" thread and you're quickly shoved right back into self oblivion with the level and walkthrough in hand.
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Re: Overly Complex Levels

Post by Phil » 07 Jan 2020 13:58

Only if you choose to place it in hand.

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Re: Overly Complex Levels

Post by Jorge22 » 07 Jan 2020 14:13

You know, I try not to look at walkthroughs. I do though, whenever I really must because my patience is exhausted and/or something doesn't seem to make sense. Written walkthroughs have an obvious advantage, which is being able to search for key words. Video walkthroughs, on the other hand, allow us to view certain things that one may find harder to understand in writing (unless they're some kind of freaking error and trial plus silly comments mess). So, my take is (and has always been) both are valuable and valued.
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Re: Overly Complex Levels

Post by Drakan » 07 Jan 2020 14:22

vimmers wrote:
07 Jan 2020 12:01
i don't understand why you people read reviews before you play a level
i never do that
Exactly my point of view, I don't care about comments.
To play a level, I just click to see the screens and if they are to my taste, I play. If there are no screens I don't play.
And those that I have not played, sorry the day is only 24 hours :) .
The building is just a passion that we can share here, with a different style for everyone, who does not necessarily please everyone.

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Re: Overly Complex Levels

Post by lizard queen » 07 Jan 2020 15:20

Phil wrote:
07 Jan 2020 13:58
Only if you choose to place it in hand.
The point is once the walkthrough is created, there is no more participating in the "Stuck in a Level" threads. And don't get me wrong, Phil... I am very much appreciative of the walkthroughs as I think you know, no? :D
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Re: Overly Complex Levels

Post by Phil » 07 Jan 2020 15:45

I disagree with your premise. Many players, aware of the availability of written or video walks, are also appreciative of the stuck thread and the contributions made there by vimmers and others, so they shun the former in favor of the latter.

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Re: Overly Complex Levels

Post by lizard queen » 07 Jan 2020 15:49

Phil wrote:
07 Jan 2020 15:45
I disagree with your premise. Many players, aware of the availability of written or video walks, are also appreciative of the stuck thread and the contributions made there by vimmers and others, so they shun the former in favor of the latter.
It's just that once there's a walkthrough, every answer to every question after that is... "There is now a walkthrough for that..."
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Re: Overly Complex Levels

Post by Jorge22 » 07 Jan 2020 15:49

Yes, yes, yes. They're three different kinds of help and they're complementary. If I have to, I'll use them all just like I'll use none.

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Yes to that too. But not necessarily.
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